Welcome to Episode three of the Bandhive Podcast.

It is time for another episode of the Bandhive podcast. My name is James Cross, and I'm here with Aaron Gingras, the drummer and manager of suburban samurai. How's it going, man?

Good. Glad to hear it before we get too far into this episode. If you haven't already left us a rating or review in apple podcasts or iTunes, it would mean ah lot if you go do that because it helps immensely when you are launching a podcast. So, please, if you haven't already done that, we would be insanely grateful on that note. Erin, what have you been up to you this week? I'm fresh off of Ah had a gig last night down the Mass like 3. 5 hours out, something like that, just far enough away where it really felt like we were like outside of the the home and, you know, the play.

But it was it was awesome. We had a friend from those parts that kind of just wanted toe put on a gig, and it was sort of, ah, smaller show. But it was, you know, one of those, like we hadn't seen him in a while. The other band was totally killer. And so it's just gonna be a good time. And it turned out to be a great time. Yeah, it was awesome. Yeah, that's always like a fun show, even though it's just one off just to get out there and get beyond.

I don't want to see your comfort zone because I think you're perfectly comfortable playing a show there. But it's not like your local hometown audience or your home state audience. You kind of reach a point where you don't want to play. You know the spot down the street every week because that doesn't really you know, it might be fun, but, you know, for me, I'd get kind of the same thing out of, like a proper practice or a rehearsal, whereas usually in my experience, like there's not really too much positivity that comes out of, like, over saturating the same spot night after night.

And, yeah, so it's close enough where it's like, Easy to get down there and sit back, but far enough away where it's totally another group of people and you know, people you don't see a lot. Um, yeah, it was really cool. It was nice to get out of Vermont for a night we had toe recently, like take our van out back and put her down. So you know, we're taking advantage of the forced off to or time Thio writing recording stuff, But there's still sort of that, you know, really miss kind of driving somewhere and playing somewhere we've never played before and then getting the heck out of there and doing it again, eh?

So it's nice to, you know, pick me up, you know, keep the blood flowing kind of a thing. That's good night. Yeah, for sure that Z, it's good to get back out there and get back on your feet after you have to put your van out of its misery. Yes, that's a tough one. And if our podcast editors any good there will be a gunshot sound effect. S o r i p Did the van have a name? I think we tried to give it a lot of names, most of which were probably pretty inappropriate.

Or but no, no, nothing stuck. Nothing was. I think all the obvious, you know, the like name famous person named puns were all taken. And so we haven't no big, ugly yellow van. Yeah, I was about to say, for those who don't know, the van was yellow. And since you already talked about putting it down, I think we will have to retroactively name the van Old Yeller. That's a good one. Is that the one where they they like, uh, Pau gives the kid a rifle? Yeah, that's really Yeah.

So if you want to see that movie, it's really, really sad. It's a great movie, but it's really sad. It's classic. It's from what, the fifties or sixties? Probably its's. I think it It felt like a young rock and roller who got a band van Damn old Yeller and how to bring it out back and put it down right? Exactly. Well, cool. This week we have ah, fun, but also serious topic. We're gonna talk about five, maybe even six different ways to avoid becoming that band at shows.

You don't wanna be that bad. It's not a good thing. You don't want people talking about you saying, uh, those guys not again. So this week, starting things off. Aaron, what's our first thing to Dio? To not become known as that band. The first and sort of most obvious, perhaps one of the most obvious things you could dio it. Just be prepared. Know what you're getting yourself into and your group? You know, if you're kind of captain of your ship into, um, kind of running through a couple of items here, advance your shows?

No, your gear situation. If you were to ask me, I'd say, Don't ask to borrow other people's gear. Uh, you know, Or if you do, don't do it last minute. Hey, can I borrow your trash symbol E. I mean, we could get in. It's like, you know, be prepared just, you know, think I had a time. So that way, when you're walking through the door, you don't really have to do anything but execute the things you've already talked about doing and the way that you've already talked about doing them, Um, and again for me, I could come at it from a couple of different angles, but just, uh, hot off of the gig last night.

I'm thinking, you know, coming from, like, drummer corner of the room in my head. Uh, yeah, Don't you know, just know? Know what you're going to be playing through if it's, you know, like a You know, if you're gonna be on a proper stage with, you know, proper, like front of house system, everything's getting miked up. Or if you're, you know, playing a smaller spot where, like, you get three vocal mix, maybe a cake mike, and that's it or or something in between. But just whatever it is, you know, know what you're getting yourself into, Uh, maybe be proactive and kind of ask whoever it is that you're speaking to you about the show if they want anything from you, any sort of input list or stage plot.

You know, if neither one of you have said my bands a guitar player, a bass player in a drummer, I would hope that that person, if they're, you know, running sound or setting up the show would have, like, Gandhi your Facebook page by that point. But at the same time, I don't know if you can assume that they know anything about your band if you haven't talked about it. So, you know, pretend like nobody knows anything until you talk about it. And then I think if you think of everything in that way, you know, you're you're really gonna minimize what could go wrong and the risk all the way from who you are, where you are when you're gonna be there, what the venue is all the way through.

How are we going to wrap up the good time at the end of the night? Yeah, and it sounds like a lot of what you're talking about is just communication. So everyone is on the same page, which is obviously something that's really key for something that, you know, you might never have met these people before, and you might never work with them again. Or even if you do work with them again, you're set up, has changed or their set up has changed. So you mentioned something called in advance which for the listeners who don't know which might actually be a lot of you on advance is essentially where you sit down and have a phone call ideally or less ideally, and a messenger conversation or email thread.

But best case scenario and sorry Millennials. Aaron and I both millennials as well, but sometimes you just got to get on the phone and hash things out. You sit down and talk with the venues production manager or sound guy, or if it's like a super D I wife and you're just the guy booking the show and say, Hey, this is what we have and you send them a stage plot and an input list and say, Can you accommodate this? Are there any issues? If you're doing a basement show, you're probably not gonna have your full input list, nor would you need it.

But something that would be especially good to know is if your band uses backtracks, make sure the venue has something to playback. Tracks like that will kill your show if you use backtracks and you don't ask the venue and you show up and they have no way to put your backtracks into the P A system that just could potentially stop your show right there, depending on how much you rely on the backtracks. I think that's a really that point is a specific point. But also sort of like the broader idea that you just introduced in that you might be playing a I mean, hopefully you're playing like a 500 cap room because that be awesome.

Great for you. But you also might go on play basement or, you know, a small club or a bar, or like, you know, whatever it is that you're you know is your thing s O, I think sort of. It sounds like what you kind of introduced there is, like, you know who you're working with. And I mean, sort of, you know, have an idea of what the expectations they're gonna be and then communicate them or figure out what they are. But it's like an important pieces recognizing and being okay.

You know, with the different people who you're working with and where they're coming from because, you know, like you could have a conversation A and inside conversation A is the most thorough walk through of everything that one would need from the moment you and your band. And if you have a crew, your crew wake up and do that morning all the way through, where you're getting each meal, what they're gonna do minute to minute throughout the entire day so that the show until you get out of there.

And if you're playing, you know, like a theater or large club or a lot of other spaces. If you bring all of that in front of the table, that person at the at the gigs, first of that's probably what they're going to expect, but they'll be very happy, you know, if their expectations were met, because that's everything that they need. But if you introduce that same conversation, A like you said like a basement gig like they're probably not going to read it, they're going to get annoyed because I'm not trying to say that somebody who runs basically when you can't be serious about what they do, because I've known a lot of people to be really passionate about using that medium, to sort of try to propel like local music, and I think that's just Justus important as anything else.

But at the end of the day, and maybe this is sort of jaded Aaron talking. But my expectation would be I'm not going to send you no basement person the same advance as I would like a theater person because I'm just not going to expect one of those people to read it. But I think that sort of adds to like, you know, another layer to what you're saying, which is, like, uh, communicate, figure out what the needs are and then meet those needs. But it would never be bad to be prepared over prepared.

And you can always, I think, kind of like back off. I agree. And I think that's a great point for two reasons. One. I see a lot of bands who play local shows D i Y shows. And then they get onto, you know, maybe like a local festival on their opening up for a larger touring band. And the festival organizers expect that same level of professionalism from the local band. So they'll say, Hey, we need a stage plot in an input list and a local band has no idea.

I can't tell you how many times I've gotten a message from somebody being like Hey, I was asked for a stage plot. Like, what is that? S o typically, I have no problem. Like if it's a band, I no, I'm friends with. I'll just do them a favor and be like, Hey, like, send me a picture of your current set up and, you know, I'll have a few questions for you, and I'll just make a stage plot for you because it takes me, like, 10 or 15 minutes. It's not gonna be amazing stage plot, but it's something that they could send in for this one show and have that good to go.

The second thing. I love what you said about having a different process for smaller shows. Yeah, it's sort of like a cookie cutter is not the right word, but, you know, a different recipe. Different, you know, model saved on your computer where you can like I'm going to play this small space. I'm gonna open this up, make a few adjustments, save as you're done. Exactly. And I might even take that a little further if you have it all. A more complex production set up than the average band.

No, the space you are playing And if it's like a small basement or a D I Y show, don't bring everything like if you're lucky enough to be a more established band and, you know, have 4 12 stack on each side of the stage for your two guitarists and, like 8 10 AM Peg Bass Cab and a full drum kit with, you know, like what? Three toms for Tom's Like you're going all out, you're that dude who has all the drums. That's fine if you're doing a big stage show. But if you're playing a basement show, you know, maybe see if you have, like a combo AMP that you could take because that 4 12 chances are it's not going to sound good, especially if it's a two bed unless you turn it all the way up.

And that's just the nature of tube amps. But if you have a combo AMP, I know it's not ideal. It's not solid state, but you're playing in a basement. Nothing is going to sound good anyway. Nothing's ideal. Exactly. The driver might go off. Yeah, it's just read the room because there's I will say, like I've definitely played a basement where, like that's what those people are into. Let's bring the whole rock show to a basement, but it's also like, you know, they might not be into that whatsoever.

And so it's Yeah, just like read the room. Sort of, exactly. If it's a basement, chances are like they live upstairs. It's their house. Be respectful and be totally hard cord if they want you to be. But not if they don't want you to be. Yeah, and on that note to like, you're only making your own life easier. Because if you show up with all this heavy year, it's a basement show. There's not an elevator. You're gonna have to lug it downstairs. What would you rather carry?

A tube head and a 4 12 cab or a combo? AMP. It's just easier to take the combo AMP it obviously, you know, if you're on the road, if you're touring, you're not gonna have to full setups. But if this is a local show and you have, like a smaller set up you can take, that's probably gonna be much more appropriate. Same thing you know, in in a basement. Tom's don't get miked. That's just not happening. So Tom's typically and you know you're a drummer, Erin, in my opinion, Tom's get lost very, very easily if they're not miked because they're just kind of doop doop doop and they sound great when they're miked up.

But if they're not miked, you're just in a base, especially the base that I'm picturing. And I think you're probably figuring the same one you're just gonna your like, Google on. And that's about it like that. You're just going to get a bunch of, you know, kind of washi. You know, something with a couple of percussive things, a two best. And that being said, if my guitar players listening to this somewhere or at some point down the line, don't get any ideas because I'm I'll be a jaded because I don't have, like, I feel like my drum set is like I could get more minimal, but I feel like it is where I don't you know I've got to Tom or drag down on the floor.

Tom and I could become more minimal, but I'm absolutely not excessive, but I feel like at a certain point, if you're doing a whole drum set, you can't pare down much more when you were just certain point. Whereas I think you're absolutely right where people who play through amplifiers like Do It Points have that choice. And so my guitar player is going to get in trouble if he shows up with a lot lighter than my stuff, because I'm gonna be so freaking mad. But the pluses then he can help you out, carrying your stuff.

That is a good point. That is a good point. Yeah, and I mean, it's like, you know, Iraq Tom in a floor. Tom, I would say, is for most people the absolute minimum already. But if there's a drummer out there to push me further, yeah, but I know it's some people. That's their thing, though, like, you know, floor Tom Snare drum kick. I had one simple or and that like works really well for some people because it's like, kind of the feel, like a like an aesthetic choice.

Almost a that point. Yeah, stylistic. It's a statement. Yeah. On the other hand, if you're one of those bands where you have to rack Toms and two floor Toms, if you're gonna go play basement dude, leave one of the racks and one of the floors in the van or in the trailer in the basement. It's not gonna actually matter, like people aren't going to notice that difference, Really, Like it's a basement show. Or I think at the very least, be prepared for that toe. Have toe be done.

It's definitely like I've again, Even with mine, it's There's certain situations where, like, you know, if I go and play a smaller show photos that I've seen, like that's that will probably be a little bit tight, you know? And you kind of start to think, like, how am I gonna pull things in or, you know, how are we going to get creative with this if you know I'm not a fan of those situations, but, like I'm also not better than them either. Like it happens and like some of those shows, air still pretty awesome.

So I think it's just, you know, like if it's part of I don't know, I I'm not pushing back, but I will. I will say is a drummer, though, Um, if it's much more, I don't have a tactile or tax is the right word, but it's sort of I would sort of draw a parallel, and the world may disagree with me, but I would draw a parallel between, um maybe, like a like a like a drum set. And like, how somebody hasn't set up in what pieces they use.

Um, a certain point. You're definitely just being annoying if you have nine, Tom's absolute or, like, a like a rack mounted everything. Yeah. Great drama. No offense, but hey, could do the same thing with much lark it. Yeah, but I think if you're trying to be Neil Pert in a basement goto hell, but, uh but yeah, I was almost draw to be a totally selfish drummer. Drink like a parallel between, like, a the set up of a guitar to like a drum set. Sort of in that it is Yeah, it is.

And again, I think a good drummer would be ableto Accola me to that. But it doesn't mean it's fun or easy or, you know, my three off. So it's like it's the same. It's like you're sitting in a movie theater knowing you're watching a movie. You know, eso I'd understand how it could be like, harder to get in the zone, but absolutely be prepared like you're going to find yourself in a situation where you're just you're going to need to make that compromise and it all comes down toe loops back to communication.

Like if you know, like, if it's I mean, I'm I'm in a band where we all really like to use Oliver and stuff because we've worked hard to get it and we'd like to dialed it in. And, you know, we care about the sound and we've worked a long time to get there. Um, and and so I think for like, 90% of the time, you know, we'd fight you toe, use our own stuff, you know, it's kind of part of the thing. And, uh, you know, the audio aesthetic.

But yeah, there is a still a certain point where at times we've we've cave because it's like, Oh, it's just, you know, it's not gonna happen or it's it's gonna happen. But if we force it, nobody's gonna like us or it's gonna be difficult. So, you know, I were super are back ends are super tight when it comes thio being really what story? Um uh, stubborn and and myself in particular. But it's like even for the most stubborn person like you're gonna run into that And like, you gotta be prepared toe kinda Just talk to people and back off when you need Thio.

You know, it's different when you're in, like, a 200 cat place, and somebody's trying to force feed you something. But fear in the basement. You gotta be okay. What? You need to be okay with E. I'll take responsibility for this tension. Well, I think that ties well into one of the points under the prepared here, which is don't ask to borrow gear last minute like, First of all, if you have your own gear, you're just gonna do a better show because it's your gear. You know how it works.

I hope you wouldn't go to someone else and asked to borrow that a guitar. But I see that happening with amps and drums all the time. Like it's I hear the word shells once more, my head's gonna explode. You have a point which that will tie into one of our points later about respecting venue staff. But I'll get to that story later. For now, Let's wrap up this first point, which is just be prepared. Know what you're going into? The next point is really a quick one, which is just show up on time.

So many times I've seen bands just like half an hour or an hour late, and it doesn't make them look good and it slows down the whole show. It could mean that bands get their set times cut because, you know, if the first band is late and then they keep saying, Oh, well, we'll be there soon will be there soon Wait for us rather than just like shuffling around the set times that just ends up hurting everyone or the show runs late, and that's no fun either.

I think that's really a plain and simple one. But one quote that I've always heard, which I really like, is, um, in the music industry. If you're 15 minutes early, you're on time. If you're on time, you're late, and if you're late, you're fired. That's a good one. It Zahn you know, like if you if you are driving down 95 year, there's an accident on that highway somewhere every other day it's like on you to build in, you know, on top of being a few minutes early because it's up to you to build in that 30 minute contingency Thio stuff and a Dunkin Donuts getting stuck behind the slow tractor trailer, like whatever it is like.

Oh, I, my guitar player woke up late. You know, it's like it's like that's a great excuse, but you're still late. Like, What does that do for me? You know, exactly the House person, It's Yeah, your homework. It's so simple. Its's kind of and a lot of people, depending on the situation myself included. Um, you know, if I wake up on the wrong side of the bed like, it's kind of disrespectful in some circles as well, you know, especially if you're, um, you know you're doing a festival gig or you're you're you're participating in an event which is kind of like, larger than yourself like that.

You're one component of, um, you know, it's it's kind of hurting. Everybody else is well, even if you know, and some things like you're just out of your control stuff happens. But, uh, you know, try to make that the exception, not the thing that keeps on happening. And then people will notice if, like, you have a good reputation for, like, having your stuff in order being on time, which again is a few minutes early. Um, you know, budget for all that stuff. And people really appreciate it because, like the one time they have somebody else who isn't is easy to work with.

Like they'll be like God, like I really wish James Cross was here because like, my night would have been so much easier. Yeah, its's super silly, but like it goes a long way, I think, yeah, it definitely does. And not to stereotype genres. But from all the shows I've worked, there have been certain genres, which I'm not going to name where 99% of the time, literally. And I'm not exaggerating almost every show I've worked in those genres. The talent has been late. Bye, a long shot, and I've even toured with, uh, it was a co headlining tour and I did a tour, and one of the acts was in that genre, and that act was always late to Van call and that kind of stuff, like out of the two or three weeks on tour.

I think there were only two days where they weren't late for for lobby call to get in the van and drive to the next city so that that's really something, that it might seem cool and like the hip thing to do in your genre. Just don't do it, though, because people outside of your genre will hate working with you. And I don't know why if there's a bigger picture like cultural thing that affect that genre disproportionately or if that's just part of, like the lifestyle of that genre.

But that is one way too easily become known as that band. So long story short. If you don't want to become known as one of those bands, show up on time. If you're in a genre that is known for being a little lax, today's ical with punctuality like that word E don't even know where I learned that. I just was like, Hold it out like days. Yeah, persnickety was that I stole that word. I won't say who I still love from, but just show up on time.

And if you can prove people wrong about your genre, like if you're in one of those genres who's known for being late. Prove them wrong. Don't. Yeah. Don't fit the stereotype that will just make you look that much better and give you a better chance of success in the long run with your music career moving on. What is point number three on our list? Aaron, So is the longest title I could have come up with, So I'm gonna try toe, read it and sort of condense it at the same time.

T l d r. If you're a guest. Like, if you're playing, If you're playing at the venue, consider yourself a guest. You know, kind of be happy that you're there because they didn't have to book. You are agreed toe host your event. Even if you're renting a room out. Um, you know, and so sort of. Even if you've worked hard at your art or your music, Um, and, you know, you feel like you, uh, maybe deserve a certain something. Um, stop thinking that, you know. And that's not to say you haven't busted your ass toe to get where you are on DATs not saying you haven't worked really hard to If you know wherever your gig is tomorrow, it's like, you know, it's a really important one.

Not to say that you haven't worked hard to get to whatever point in your career that you've you've you know, you're waking up this morning, you know, being out. Um, but, you know, don't act that way. Um, be consistent and act like you're the guest. Whatever gig you're at on, people will notice. And if you sort of remind yourself of that, uh, they're also going to notice that you do that and they're just going to think you're a jerk. So just gonna be pleasant, polite, suck up.

It goes a long way. And this goes for any level of artist, too. And, you know, first of all, I fully agree with that even if you have earned it and you deserve to be there, that doesn't mean don't be nice. Like you could still be polite and treat people like human beings, which will segue into our next point. But it does remind me of a story. A few years ago, bring me the horizon. Was playing a festival like in Spain or somewhere I love Bring me the horizon is music.

But honestly, I think they're jerks. Oh, no, I haven't heard this. Yeah. So when they played this festival, pictures of a flyer that was distributed to security started floating around on social media. And basically, it said in big, bold letters like Do not stop this band or ask them for passes. They could go anywhere they want. And it was bring me the horizon. It had all of their faces, like all five or six of them. And basically they didn't wanna wear a pass like off all the things to be stuck up about.

Just have a pass. You could take it off when you go on stage like I could think of so many local level bands who like where passes when they don't need thio. So that's like a game changer. And they were. They should and they don't Was that Did that come from sort of the band's team themselves? There was that, like a local security guy like thinking ahead, being like they're going to give you trouble. Or I would have to assume that was from the band's team themselves, because they were not the top level band on that festival, they were like they were up there.

But I think, like Foo Fighters was on the festival to and this was before bring me the horizon blew up. This is, like 20. And, you know, David would, like, sit and have lunch with whoever. Yeah, would be the total opposite e I like their music to of it. Yeah. Yeah. So for And I have to say I actually, like, bring me the horizons Newer music more than their older metal core stuff which, you know, go ahead and judge me for my taste in music. But that's just kind of a jerk move like And I know of other artists who have done that.

You know, I'm not going to name names because some of them I've heard of, you know, from friends in the industry. I'm only talking about this one because, you know, it's all over the news, like press and stuff covered it. But I could say that you know, if it's one person and it's like your show, like if you're a rock star and it's your show and you want people to recognize your face, okay, like, I'll give you a break. But don't put it on a flyer and tell them not to do so at a festival where you're not headlining and they have to memorize five different faces.

Like like I paid extra for that and and to be clear, the people guarding the port a potties. I hope that person was paid extra that day. It's just one of those things that it's entirely unnecessary. And I would argue that even if bring me the horizon was headlining just because there's five of them, I would say Don't do it like there's not one superstar. If it were someone like you know Willie Nelson and I'm not saying Willie Nelson did this, I have no idea if he did or not.

He's not one of the people heard about. I'm just saying he's a recognizable guy, So if he's headlining a show like probably gonna know, it's Willie Nelson over there, Yeah, you put up a picture and be like It's this old dude with really long hair like white hair like it's Willie Nelson and his face is very distinct s. So that's understandable. Like okay, Willie Nelson, I would say he's earned that, but at this point, like I said, bring me the horizon was not at that level yet.

They were big, but they weren't big like they are now. And, uh, it's just one of those things that it would apply to the same level of, like, local bands. You know, absolutely whether you're like shipping your like, whether you're like a nine or 19 truck tour and like, be the person to ship your home furniture ahead to the next hotel room, Um, or anywhere between that and then being, you know, the local band playing the bar or the d I Y venue or the local club or whatever it is on dya know, think that you're, you know, top shit for for that particular week.

Um, you know, like, you'd be surprised. I've met both of those people and I've worked with both of those people and like, it's the same attitude, which is the funniest thing, s So it's Yeah, it's as you're saying, it Z doesn't matter like, well, it's like you're you're gonna work with those people no matter what swimming pool you're hanging out in or what sandbox you're playing in. But, um, which one would think Oh, what an opportunity like, you know, I don't have to track four different behaviors to stay away from its just that one, that everybody knows the shitty eso.

And so it should be easier. You know, Just just don't be a jerk. And that's what really all of this comes down to. This whole episode is like Do your best, don't be a jerk. And that ties perfectly into our fourth point, which is respect other bands and venue staff, including the time of these bands and staff and their gear. That's a rabbit hole. That's yeah, that's a full of pessimism and jaded nous. Yeah, which I would say and learning opportunities. This is true learning opportunities, but I'm laughing.

But really, though it's it's really it's a non opportunity Thio. Any show is like an opportunity to like, I would think to like, look at the other band, see how they're doing stuff and, you know, kind of tighten your own screws a little bit each time. And I'm still working on that with love stuff, too. So it's, you know, learning is never done for a much as I could make fun of it. It's learning has never done. I would agree with that. And, you know, I try to learn something new every day.

And, you know, part of this podcast is I'm learning your perspective on things, too, because even though I play music myself, my experience within the music industry's mawr as somebody who helps other bands and runs shows from production side of things. So I'm learning from you, too, because you are in a D i y band. You've played several 100 shows with that band you do about 100 a year, I think, uh, not quite at this point, that's I think that's a good mile marker, uh, to sort of aim towards we've been doing, I think, bit less than that.

It's It's been about 30 to 50 years in the last couple years, sort of gradually increasing, still very respectful you for a lot of people, that's not a lot, but for us, that's that's been quite busy, so we're happy. It's all scalable, cool. And so I think having your perspective on things is really good for me because I get to learn, you know, the struggles of the D I band. Obviously, I know some of the big ones, and I know how to help avoid them. But you think of things that I might not think of.

And one thing that we were chatting about last week after we recorded the episode, we were talking about bands who take forever to set up on stage or bands who set up all their gear and then get on stage and tune their guitars, which that just kind of sets the mood. Even if you play in great set, it sets the mood. I don't know how to say this without sounding mean, but if you don't take 30 seconds to tune your guitar before you get on stage, what are you doing on stage like?

Okay, I understand. Maybe, you know, your pedal boards set up and you have everything ready to go, ideally, to put on stage quickly rather than you know, taking onto stage and then setting it up like it's all set up. You have to put it together. Yeah, but if that's the case and you can't do it, cause your tuners on your pedal board and it's ready to go on stage have like a 15 $20 tuner that you can plug into or get ahead Stock Tune and it's like $8 and just tune your guitar before you get on stage and have it ready to go.

Like once your gears on stage, you should start playing. Don't spend you know, an extra two or three minutes fiddling with settings or tuning in guitar or anything like that. Just be ready to play. And that also goes into another point, Erin, which you have on here, which is getting off of stage. Do you wanna talk about that a bit? Well, I think it would vary depending on who you're talking to. But, I mean, I could totally come at it from getting off stage is just is important, if not maybe at times more important than getting on stage, because I think getting on stage is very important to the band is getting on stage.

Um, but then you kind of got to think of it, or in the team supporting the band while they're onstage. But then, uh, if you're playing two out of four, or God forbid, if you're in a show of eight bands or something, uh, you know, you're the process of like you getting your stuff off. The freaking stage is important to you and everybody else who has to get their stuff onstage or like pack up the audio gear or, I don't know, lock the door at the end of the night and go home on DSO, and it's it might be silly to kind of bring it that far, but I'll fight, you know it's not.

It's, um yeah, just, you know, stage. You're like, as you mentioned, like stage your gear at the ready. Whether it's, you know, if your guitar player you can only do so much like put your, you know, get your amp out, get it ready. But the tune your guitar was there like a drummer. The first thing I do and I load in is, uh, talk with the people. See what makes sense in terms of where I could put our stuff if I can, you know, kind of a set of my stuff in the middle of the room or to go find a corner somewhere out of the way.

But it is a drummer, and or, you know, if there's anybody who's, you know, placed percussion or you know some other large sort of, you know, instrument. That's not like housed in a container or like a like an aunt or something. Um, right. Like your stuff here? Yeah, like, set yourself up to knit just like you would a guitar and and like, So you're ready to bring it on stage. And then, theoretically, if you do everything beforehand before you bring it on stage, getting off stage is, like Should be Azizi is like picking up your thing and then walking away with it and then maybe doing it seven or eight more times, depending on how much stuff you have.

But it's like because then the person who's about to get on stage like you're gonna holding them up, and that's not going to feel good for them, especially if they, like, take pride and like tuning their guitars and their drums And, you know, making sure that even even if something is silly, but it's a real thing that happens. Uh, you know, staging which things like even if you have like, a corner, you're shouting all your stuff in. If it's one of those kids, uh, in what order do you shove stuff into that corner?

first. Like last night. It was a good example. And it's the silliest, stupidest thing. But it saves time. And just for me, it's worth. It s so you don't have to get aggravated, like move around people or move stuff. You know, if you're coming at it from if you're only able to come at it from a tiny little staircase and stage left, put all your stuff that's gonna go up on stage right first and then even the drum set, like so, if you're a righty, Crash ride floor, Tom kick and then you know, just like that and it zit might be nit picky, but, uh, chances are it's not, especially if you're again.

Last night, I was kind of in a smaller space, and that made all the difference on Ben. Do it in the exact officers order on the out. Just take your stuff out. And so that way you're kind of doing the band after you a favor. Um, you know, kind of trying to give them the most time that they can't have to work with. Um, exactly. Exactly. And that's kind of you know what you were saying for you as a drummer. I know you do this, and I know a lot of numbers do this.

Which is? You pick up a single stand, you put it on the stage and it's good to go. You don't have to put the symbol on it. You have to unfold it. Then when you leave the stage, you pick up the simple stand with a symbol on it and take it off stage. Then I see the local and experience bands who unscrew the wing nut on top. Take the symbol off, put the symbol down through the wing nut back on, start folding up the symbol stand and repeat that for like the three or four symbols.

You know, the high hat that two crashes the ride. And they do that for their snare stand cause that the tripod to they do that for their four times. It's like, no, take it off stage and then you break it down and sing with that. I don't want to just pit. I'm a drummer, so I'm gonna pick on drummers. But it's also the state like, you know, disassembling your pedal board or your guitar regular. You know you don't do something that's gonna like damage your cable or whatever it is.

But like there's probably a way toe put it all in your you know, like whatever kind of fold your arms up, take it off or, you know, or like, have some sort of, you know, have a milk crate. You could put it in its, you know, don't damage your stuff. But you know there's a there's a way to do it, you know, rather than kind of like everything. Wrap it up, pull it, you know, put it back in your little case and it Z, you know. And that's the thing for a pedal board that's the entire idea of a pedal board is you could pick up the whole thing.

Yeah, unplugged the input from the guitar and unplug the output. The AMP. And then you can pick up the pedal board with all the pedals, like velcroed or glued, or whatever method you use. Pick up that whole board. Take it off stage. Get your amp get your guitar. The one exception, I would say, probably is always like if it's a guitar or base or something that's fragile like that, you can put in the case as soon as you take it off stage, you know, take that first, put it in the case, then come back and take everything else off at that point. Specialty. Elektronik. Exactly. Computer.

You know, if you're running something totally, but you shouldn't be putting anything in a case right away. The main idea should be get things off the stage. This is because, like Aaron said, if there's a band playing behind you or just for the venue staff. But another thing to consider is if you're slow and setting up and the venue or the production manager is straight with set times, you're cutting into your own set time. If you are slow in tearing down, you are cutting into the next vans.

Set time, and that is not okay, because in that band is affected by your actions. Same thing. If you're slow tearing down and you're making the venue staff stay late, they might be sick. They might have another job to get to. If they work overnight somewhere. Yeah, exactly. They want to go have dinner with their family. Yet you know, Midnight, let the dog out. It's so easy to get caught up in, like that tour, tour like Show Bubble, But it's like you're still very much operating and, you know, every single real world.

Yeah, exactly. Every single person in that venue is a person there, a human being with the life. And chances are like this is a good one to look at. Like if you're walking in somewhere that kind of ties into, like if you think you're, like, totally the hottest person in the room to like I don't know and and if it could be either If that feeds into why you're taking so long, you're late or it could be a totally separate issue. But like, I don't know in my experience, like people who work at venues like, You know, I mean, like, the rigors or something for, like, larger spaces like that lady or that guy might be a guitar player to on like, you, like they might be way better than you, you know, like they might be really, you know, like super talented, like more to.

And so just think of it that way, like if somebody who's like, uh, this kind of the pessimistic way of looking at it. But like, what Would somebody who like if you were to either look up to them, kind of like a role model or like like, um, just or what would What would somebody who's like skills that you would admire or appreciate think of what you're doing right now? You know what I mean? And it's sort of easy toe like, Oh, well, that he's like the door guy or he's you know, he's the person taking the tickets or security or something.

But like, you know, like, that person might be fluent in five languages and, like, drive a race car like you, you never know who you're dealing with. Um, you know, or they might totally sure, out on the guitar, you never know. And I have the feeling like we're just being a venue is first of all, something that a lot of people in touring bands do because the venue is flexible so they could come home, get off of tour and work at the venue. There's a lot of turn around like yeah, yeah, so you're the security guy, The sound person, the ticket person.

All of those people might actually be in touring bands and you don't realize it. And they might even be in bands more famous than you or touring crew to. I can't tell you the number of, like, pro audio folks. Um I mean, you could go to their website just as easily as I can, so I'll say, like, you know, like, I know people from Claire Audio who, um, you know, have spent time at some point when they're not on the road. They want a little pick me up or, you know, if it's a, uh, you know, sort of like a shorter travel year for them.

You know, they're all part of local unions. Wherever they are, they push boxes, you know, just asses. Well, if not better than some of the other people. Um, it's Yeah, you never You never know who you're dealing with until you know you're dealing with. And then you still shouldn't be a jerk. Yes. You know, be a role model. You know, be that person who inspires Thea other person, toe try, toe. Wanna learn something or be better. And speaking of never knowing who somebody is, go back to Episode one.

I told a story about ah local band not exactly berating but being very unkind to someone they should not have been unkind. Thio Eso You never know who you're talking Thio Another one. This is a quick one is if you had a venue, don't complain or event about any of the staff for security to the audience, you know, Unless, yeah, I would say the exception is like if you see security hurting someone, by all means, call that out and stop it. But don't be like, oh, security or jerks for doing this or doing that like No, that's that's first of all, uncalled for.

Like it doesn't matter if you're the opener or the support act of the headliner. Have your representative work it out with the venue. If there's an issue, don't start any arguments or fights on stage. I've seen touring bands do that. Yeah, that's a good way now to get invited back or just to be told no, or to start a brawl. I've seen that happen like Band Security start fighting, and then the whole audience get sucked into it, which, obviously the band shouldn't have acted like that. But I would put most of the blame on security because they're one job is to protect people.

And then if they decide to start punching people, that's theon positive. Their job, even if the band is being awful to you. But as a band, don't be awful to people. Don't start it Exactly. You know, I and I can't think of to be transparent. I cannot think of ah, particular instance like I have. You know, I know about where a band has sort of called somebody out. Um, then you reacts by, uh, not wanting them back. I can't think of a specific instance, but I cannot think of any other way for that to go.

You know, you're it's it's in front of if you are in a restaurant, you know, the staff or the venue staff, and then the people sitting down in their boobs eating french fries or the crowd. If you stand up in your booth and you start talking smack like they're not gonna wanna have you back, you're talking about you know, the staff in front of customers. Think of it like a cupcake shop. It's no different. Um, you know, it would be different if your security starts to fight, which again.

Bad apple. Get that guy out of there. But, you know, on the whole just like think before you dio Exactly. I mean, I've seen security texting instead of catching crowd surfers, and I think there's no place for that. Yeah, yeah, but if I had been on stage that evening, I would have, you know, call of the tour manager said, Hey, get that guy out of here not gone on Mike and said, What are you doing? You're not doing your job, you know, like there's a proper way to handle things and there's an improper way to handle things.

That's that's a good way to put it. It's, you know, you're gonna if you If you like their fire, you're just gonna get met by more fire. Exact. You're in a situation. You're going to do what you're gonna do, but like, try to steer what you're gonna do towards, like, a calm resolution. Yeah, I would again say the Onley exception to this ever would be if, like, something is actively going on, that needs to be stopped. Like if you see security whaling on someone, be like, Hey, cut that out.

But you know I saw this a few years ago at warp tour. Um, the story so far, Dude, jump down into the crowd up because security was being a fan. And I think in that situation, he was totally justified when he kicked a girl off stage e o. When you get offstage, that was uncalled for. Like he could have been like, Hey, get off the stage. You know, he didn't have to resort to actually like kicking him. And I got some coverage, and I'm sure that, like again, I don't know.

But I would imagine that's the kind of thing that would get some coverage from, like, whatever local news station like. That's I'm sure that's just dumb. Like, I hope they haven't. I'm sure they have insurance, but I don't know that they dio I hope they did. Because if I mean, I wouldn't imagine that that was like a 32 year old Women like that. Must have been a kid, like they got smacked in response. Yeah, like if I was her dad, I'd be up for blood. Oh, man. Since we haven't heard anything further, I would assume they settled out of court.

That's just my guess, but who knows? It doesn't mean that the girl was in the right for getting up on the stage. But there were better ways to handle that. Yeah, I think that's a really interesting world of, like, you know, like the aesthetic of one's performance and, like, meets the interaction of people who are not outside of what that performance is in that room. But outside of, uh, you know, the circle of performers who are sort of perpetuating like this is what this is tonight. Um, you know, I think for that and again, I've e don't wanna, like, made open the door for James.

Sort of good a bunch of hate mail for this one. But like, yeah, its simplest terms that comes down Thio, You know, I would have, like, barked its security like this person off stage and, like, I would have even thought that to have been like, like, you're grumpy jerk, but like way that someone drop kicking somebody back, you know, it's like But, you know, I guess I'm happy that he was that into his own performance that night, where you just Wow, he's in the zone. Speaking of dropkick, there was also that incident.

Oh, I am. This is, like, 2013, and this neo Nazi got up on stage and started saluting s okay, in case he just comes over and decked the dude. So in that case, I would still say Is e probably been extreme, but yeah, it's a tough one. I don't know if I wouldn't back that, though. Yeah, I definitely would side with Ken Casey like it's his stage. Yeah, e. I think there's a difference between, like, 16 or 17 year old person who's, like, so excited, like they put what's his name on a pedestal, I'm sure, Just like I did when I was, You know, whatever artist was at that level when I was that age.

It's, you know, just getting a photo. It's somebody you're probably never going to see again, like is different than, uh, you know, supporting hate and yeah, Casey, for that one. That was that. You know that I condone violence, but, you know, I don't know if I would have thought to act any differently if a Nazi came on stage, and I'm sure the audience loved that shit down, you know? Yeah. Dropped his never been quiet about their stance on social justice or politics or anything like that. I mean, like, every other post they make is about helping people or, you know, supporting unions and stuff like that.

They're very open about that. So, yeah, what do you expect? You you get on stage and there's a bunch of dudes who grew up in South Boston like houses that turn out. Yeah, so that was a long rabbit hole. Multiple interesting stories, both pro and con, the better part can. And political, which you know, on the note of being respectful. Just being respectful. Don't be a jerk to people like this is uncalled for. Uh, but props to Ken Casey props the Parker cannon for defending that fan.

Not props to Parker Cannon for taking some poor girl in the back. You know, it goes both ways. Yeah, that's fair. One other little one we have is when you're on stage. Don't ask if this sounds good, Bond. I've been around the receiving end of this, and I think most bands say it perfectly innocently. They don't realize that, but if you have a professional sound engineer doing sound for you. It is their job to make you sound good. If you don't sound good, not gonna lie. That's probably your fault.

Like if you're sound, guy's any good and you don't sound good. That's your own fault. Like a sound guy never wants a mix to sound bad because that makes them look bad. One time I was working a show where there was a local opener, some girl in acoustic guitar, part way through the show. Her guitar started buzzing. And for me, of course, is a sound urging around you. Okay, like the little nine volt battery in her guitar is dead. But so she on the mic on the mic in front of the whole crowd goes the sound guy.

Hey, can you fix that buzzing Sound nice and it's like, Oh, this is not gonna end well, because I knew that it was her guitar. So I figured the sound guy, if he's worth anything, knows that as well, because the dying battery and die makes a specific sound. Well, the sound guy gets on the talk back mic and cranks it and goes, I can't fix it, but you can if you have another battery for your guitar. Her response, I don't remember exactly, was something along the lines of.

There's a battery in here, so she got the guitar and never swapped out the battery. So on that note, if there's something going wrong, think about first and it might actually be on your end. Work together. Exactly and together she ended up borrowing somebody else's guitar, which is literally the headliners guitar. She's like, Oh, can I use your guitar eso that ties into that story earlier of Don't Ask to borrow gear last minute. If you have anything that's battery operated, whether it's active pickups and a bass or guitar or, you know the output of an acoustic guitar or a belt pack wireless microphone.

I'm all for not wasting Resource is like batteries and stuff like that because it's horrible for the environment. But either get rechargeable batteries and recharge them before every single set, or just buy a new battery and swap it out every single set or my favorite is I. I don't often live at this point with this ban, uh, play with a metronome because I'm like I'm in, too, just like you know, if stuff kind of slides or whatever. It's sort of like like natural, you know, like if it's, um fast and punk.

And But when I do or like, practices when I dio like I'm definitely afraid of, you know, like, you know, I understand. Like people don't have the resources to, um, you know, you're at a certain level where the standard is to switch out belt pack batteries or this and that every other show. But that being said, there are a lot of people who can't afford to do that. And I'm one of them for my personal gear and gigs. And so, like by a nine volt, you know, rechargeable or rechargeable, I was gonna say, like, there's way to plug into the wall.

You can't tell your guitar into the wall, But, you know, if you're dealing with, like, a like a pedal or you know so or like a metronome like something where you can, um, you know, I consider the, uh I think if the power goes out, you're gonna have a bigger problem than this. But it would be like, yeah, like, you know, if you can plug into the wall like a battery what a great backup you know or vice versa. So again, that's the power goes out. You'll have a bigger problem.

Yeah, and I agree with that and you make a good point of not everyone's at that level. You know, I would advocate for just changing it out anyway because, like I've bought, I mean, not me. But I've facilitated the purchase of 1500 Triple A batteries before the last, you know. And it's like That's, you know, might be more realistic for some people than others. And it's but still like that Z point side, like that's that group of people like thinking, What do I need to do to make sure my battery doesn't run out?

Exactly, you know, So it's like that Shows like that's how far people will go if they have the room to go that far toe like, you know, like you could take it a Sfar as you could take it. And I would honestly say, like, you know, for those people who can't afford to swap it out, every single show when you rehearse, you still need those nine volt batteries anyway, So every show put in a new battery which a nine volt cost. Like what? Like four bucks? It's pretty cheap.

And then when you're done, pull it out. But save it and use that one for rehearsals because you're gonna ideally rehearse a lot more than you play shows. Because that's how people get better. And then just use those batteries because if it dies in a rehearsal, it's not a big deal. Or keep yourself on a schedule like it's, you know, like like a belt pack My, you know, suck more juice than you know, a guitar. You play a certain way or or or vice versa or something.

But like you just be caught like no, your gear. It ties into knowing your gear and you know, whether it's you know, every other week as your rule. Because I know I'm usually gonna practice within a span of two weeks, like eight times. And then, you know, I might have a show or something, just kind of, you know, yeah, yeah, and pretty much every reminders app out there can set Recurring reminder. So check it off, and then two weeks or whatever interval you set, it pops up again.

One last one, which I think we should breeze through because we're at 70 minute mark already. Stato watch other bands play, especially if it's a local show, and I would argue that even for bigger shows, you should stay. But if it is a local show, the other bands are guaranteed to notice because there's only like 2030 people there. If it's a big show with 700 people or even 202 150 people, the other bands might not notice. But if it is a local show, it is guaranteed that other brands will notice. And that just makes you look bad if you can't stay for whatever reason, sincerely apologize to the other bands like Hey, I'm really sorry I have to go.

But my band mates, you know A, B and C are gonna be staying here toe watch like I'm sorry I have to go home, feed my dog. That's a terrible excuse. Like make arrangements to feed your dog. But something like, Hey, you know, I'm sorry. Like I have to go home, spend time with my family because this is the one night this week I get to see them. Something like that. You know. And don't just use any excuse. It has to be something that really means you have to go or you're going to miss out on something important on one hand, I'd say Never do that.

But there are those where you do kind of, you know, maybe need thio different from person to person and situations change. And maybe you do. But if you know, like like, uh, you know, even if you're not particularly excited to see that band play their music if you don't like them or whatever, like, you know, even if you don't, um, it might be something as simple. Azaz, uh, kind of like you said, like catching up like in the beginning of the show. Like, Hey, I'm gonna have to duck out.

I might miss something. You're sat, but like, thank you for having us, you know, or something, because that way it's, you know, it's still kind of a bummer, but it shows that you're you know, you know, like you're aware that like they're aware of that and that you care exactly, or that you're telling them that you care, you know, But it's a really polite thing to do and and even if it's, there's kind of some like misalignment, they're like, you know, like they're going to notice it and appreciate like, I would definitely appreciate that for sure.

Yeah, like like Thanks, great to see you. You hug and then you never see him again, you know? Yeah, it's the polite thing to Dio, and I know for me like I've gone to see friends bands and then had to leave early because I had toe work early the next morning and stuff like that. And I felt bad leaving, even though I didn't even know the headlining band because it's a local show on like they're gonna notice people. There are a few people there, which is a tough call to make.

You know, I would say, if you're playing a show leaving early because you have to get up early in the morning is not an excuse. Like that's tour lifestyle. Anyway, I agree with that so hard it's going to stink. But it's like, all right, maybe don't make a habit of, you know, doing things that require you to be awake at 1 a.m. Yeah, in Like the restaurant industry, it's called opening closing, It s Oh, don't do that to yourself if you If you know you have to get up at six AM on a Monday morning to go toe work, don't book a show Sunday night.

Or if you do, just like no, that that's what's happening. Like like I've been both ways. Like where I know I've had a responsibility early the next morning, and it's like, here we go. You just do it and it's, you know, But if it's not something you're into, like, don't make a habit of it, it'll happen because, you know, but it's it's not their fault. It you can't plan plan your week or if something comes together in a funny way, you know, and I hate to make this outline any longer this episode because they're already at 75 minutes.

But there's one thing that I absolutely have to add under respect bands and venue staff, which is don't bail on this show. How did we not think of that going on here? That's that's like Rule number one is actually show up like and this goes both ways to start. Yeah, that should have been the first thing But this goes both ways. Don't just no call, no show. That's awful. But don't cancel at any point before hand unless it's something like a family member is in the hospital or passed away.

And you have to go to the funeral or something truly tragic that needs your immediate attention. I think we were chatting about this last week. Aaron. You said something like, you know, if your nephews, uh, you know, your nephews birthday is going on or something like that. Sorry. You committed to play a show, and that's what you're gonna dio. You know you're gonna play a show. You're gonna see your nephew next year and tell them what you did. And then you're going to be the cool rock star Uncle.

It's gonna be fine. Sticking with commitments is a huge thing there. And you know, obviously, even if you do have a terrible, tragic event, make sure the venue knows you're not showing up. Don't just no call, no show. That is the absolute worst thing you can do and will definitely get you banned from that promoter booking you again or that venue booking you If it's like a heavy enough thing that's happening. And if it's truly like I gotta go or you know there's something that's happening or something did happen or whatever, you know, if it's not, like a matter of, you know, poor planning or just, you know, I hate to say it like an excuse for some people.

If there's really like, I got to be somewhere else, Um, if you kind of, you know, don't try to get people to feel sorry for you. But like, if something really, you know, important just happened, whether it's positive or negative, Um and, you know, communicate that as you said Thio, like the people who should know what you know what's gonna happen or about to not happen. Um, chances are, if there are serious as you are, they've either been in that position themselves. Um, you know, you cover for each other, um, covers, not the right word, but they will understand.

They might not lock it and lock it like it. They might not like it on. It might not make their night any easier, but, you know, you're not going to get shit for it. Like stuff happens I've been lucky enough for for me to have not been out on the road playing with my own band while while something like, you know, either big in a positive or negative way has happened. Um, but, you know, I've missed some rehearsals for some stuff. Um, you know, and I've cut it close on.

I wish I hadn't. But a time or two, uh, you know, with some really serious stuff with some family on tour with some other people. And that's you know, all of those people understand because, you know, they're afraid of that same thing happening. So if it's really important, be open like they're going to get You don't have to overshare. But just tell them the truth. You know, I think a lot of people like overthink like, what should I? Whatever. It's just tell them the truth, like what's happening?

You know, um, stuff happens still get it, but And if you're writing to someone rather than calling, don't write a novel. Just keep it short and sweet, so they understand what's going on. But they don't need the full details. And I would go so far as to say, if you can't tell someone yourself, have your bandmates. Tell them. And if there's any possible way for your band to play that show without you, they should. Unless you're the lead vocalist or the drummer, there's probably a way for that toe happen.

Or if you're the only guitarist. Yeah, I'd say, like I've definitely seen you know, second or third guitar players peel off for a keyboard player or something, or I'd go so far as to say, like I mean, um, and again, I wouldn't be like a huge fan of it, but like, you know, like, I've I'm friends with a band who they're Singer had some stuff going on and like the band played, you know, it's like it's never going to not be like funny looking, you know, a little bit if that happens.

But, um, you know, again, it's all about communication that might not be okay. The promoter might be like, Uh, yeah, let's let's let's reschedule this or, you know, its's communication. It's all whatever's clever again. I'm stealing that from somebody else, but it's a good thing, definitely one last point, which will wrap up our five things to do to avoid becoming that band, which clearly is much more than five specific things, but it's five overarching ideas. The fifth one is Don't complain, Dio, which I know we just spent the last 75 80 minutes complaining.

But we're also teaching by example and giving examples of what we would do in certain situations and what other people do that doesn't make them look good. Mm. In this specific case, Erin, you had the example of people complaining about the local music scene but not actually participating in the local music scene to make it any better. Yeah, like I've known people who have Yeah, they've complained of, like, fucking nobody shows up, but it's like, Well, do you show up? You know, exactly. And I think we're all probably like we don't all go to every show or to every art opening or all whatever it is we're talking about.

Um, I don't. But just being cognisant of that and trying to you know, if something is important to you, you're gonna make time for it. Um, and I know a lot of people enjoy a really healthy local scene, and a lot of other people don't get to enjoy that. Um, and I think It's just a lot of people probably don't know, you know. They don't know to do what they don't know what to do. They just it's it's easy to miss, I think, because it's a well, I'm busy.

I'm doing something. But it's, uh it really goes a long way. Um and I will say, um and I'll be completely honest. Um, that's something I'm working on, like now that I'm home a little more than I have been for the last few years, and I'm being on the road as much. Um, I've been working on that, and it's still something I'm working on. It could get better at, um, but freaking like James has showed up toe like the last. I think a lot of last, like, get local gigs that we've had.

I can think of at least two or three And, um, there's, ah, local band. Um ah, local metal band who they're just starting to like, kind of really get, you know, a little bit of a thing around them. And there are a few members of that band that they show up to every one of our shows and it Z it's It's just is, it's no more complicated than that. It's it's not. And if we're thinking of the same band there, Singer actually books some basement shows as well.

Yeah, that's a good example of doing. Yeah, it's you know what I mean? Like, that's That's the whole, uh, you know, reason behind. You know, me being able to say, you know and again it's 30 to 50 shows a year is not a lot for a lot of people, but it's a lot for me to have been the person to book and where the promoter hat And, like, I've never played a show in Cleveland, Ohio, or Milwaukee, Wisconsin. How do I set that up? I know nobody there, and I made it happen.

And, you know, for the last couple of years, we've done 30 to 50 of those a year, and, um, that's a full time job. Yeah, it is. And it z just, you know, you do. It's like, I don't know, make it happen like you're gonna bang your head against the wall and is, you know, like the way I said, Like, it feels like you're banging your head against the wall and then like you know, until it's numb sometimes, But it's like that's That's how you get stuff done and like this, this band that is really great and supports other.

And it's like they I feel like I feel like they support my band and I feel like they support a lot of other bands. And so that's again, Um, that's something that kind of coming back home and finally spending a little more time at home. I'm recognizing, uh, those You guys are better at that than I am. They or they've had more of an opportunity to or they've had a head start, Whatever. I'm not too good to say. They're better at that than I am. And there, you know, I I kind of look up to that behavior like they they're honest and they can when they say we support local music, there's no way in hell you can fight him on that.

And so that Z really inspired me toe like I'm gonna go to your shows. I'm going to go see a lot of other people shows, and it's so it's, you know, uh, definitely don't try to make this sound like were, you know, both complaining a better bunch of stuff. It's like every day is an opportunity to learn something new, and and, um and so I just wanted to, you know, give them a shout out that they're doing a really good job, what they're trying to do for themselves, but also, uh, sort of really, uh, not only build upon whatever community isn't or is.

You know, there is a small scene in Vermont, but, uh, there facilitating some of that they're they're providing a platform to, you know, for for opportunity to, like, be grown upon. I guess, you know, be that person at this point, you've given them so much praise. I think we might as well name drop them. Wouldn't be so funny if we just both said a different name right now. I don't think we would, but voices in vain $10 million to both of us. Yeah, those guys, they're super nice.

And they, you know, they work hard, and, yeah, said the rest of it, you know, run into the guitar player toe gas station and gives you a hug. You know, like you guys. And I don't think it would hurt to, like, pick somebody out of your local scene who, like you, thinks totally killing it in one way. And you're doing a really good job making everybody else feel like you're part of their little circle. Exactly whether they are, aren't, you know, or or whether it's that that's your intention or not.

But it's, you know, like pick somebody you know out of your scene and, you know, sort of analyze like, what are they doing Really well. And, you know, that's the thing that I want to do really well. And, you know, spend time with that person, you know, Or if it that's probably harder, Easier said than done. But it's, um, you know, spend some time thinking about that person and, you know, hopefully you are able toe run into them a gas station and give them a hug or, you know, know them that well or something.

But it's, you know, or be the person who, if somebody else, runs into you the gas station, they want to give you a hug because they're excited to see you. Yeah, like I think that kind of encapsulates like, you know, kind of covers all the points we talked about, like, dump, you jerk. Uh, don't be a jerk. I think we did that one twice, you know, kind of be prepared. I think everybody, um, you know, is the capacity to like their tighten their nuts and bolts with that.

But, um, you know, I think, uh, trying goes a long way and being honest with yourself and others and yeah, don't complain, do Yeah, I think this is the perfect spot to end it. Huge shoutout to voices in vain for doing something to improve your local scene. I have to apologize. Actually didn't get their show at higher ground last month, but it was awful. It was It was really nice to see them be ableto enjoy something that they work hard for. Speaking of bands who have earned it and deserved to be somewhere.

They definitely deserved to play that show. And I know for a fact that they did not have an attitude about playing that show. They would have beat up the person who had an attitude exactly show because I think a couple of those guys know how hard it has been to get to that point. That is for sure. That does it for this episode of the Bandhive podcast. Thanks so much for checking it out and shout out to all the great bands we mentioned in this episode.

The next episode is all about winter touring, so if you're in the North, check it out. Thanks so much for listening. I hope you enjoyed this. And I hope you have an awesome week and you'll hear us again next Tuesday at 6 a.m. Eastern time. And as a final note, please, please, please. If you haven't already left us a rating or review in apple podcasts or iTunes, go do that now. It would mean a lot to us and make launching this podcast Ah, lot easier And get the word out to mawr D I Y bands like the band you are in So once again thanks for listening and please go leave a review.

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